This Sunday concludes the voting by Plone Foundation members for the venue of the 2009 Plone Conference, and I am sitting down to the proposals and a glass of wine so I can do a bit of web research. Having been to three Plone conferences now, I have an appreciation for the process and the Plonistas who make it happen somewhere in the world. I hope to use what conference organizing intuition I have gained over the years (been to way too many conferences in last 5 years…plus organized 3 local events of 250+ people) to place an intentional vote as a new foundation member. I am finding myself with some questions, and figure I would document my thinking about the proposals and hopefully find some more answers before I have to vote:)
In general, 2 solid proposals for the conference in October/November 2009. One for hosting the conference in Budapest, Hungary in a spot on the Buda side of the Danube River (literally looking over it) that is part of a large university. The other proposal is to host the conference in Barcelona Spain on the campus of a large university.
Let me first say that this is totally my subjective experience here and I have never been to either of these venues…I am taking the information given to me and trying to process it to make a choice. I can’t say that my interpretations of the proposals represent what was intended to be communicated…as such is the challenge with communication! Please be sure to read the proposals yourself!
Some items that made an impression on me:
Budget and Conference Management
Sounds like the Budapest team has a serious track record in event/conference organizing, and I appreciate that. Organizing conferences is a huge undertaking. Barcelona organizers also have experience in organizing (though all references seem to be “geek” conferences…I only state that because Plone conference is really the only one of those I go to!).
One important part of financing, apparently the university is willing to provide the cash upfront for organizing the event in Barcelona. That is huge and seems a bit understated in the proposal. One question I have for organizers there – what happens if you don’t come up with enough funds to pay back the funds from the university – what would conditions be? Not sure how Budapest would deal with financing the event (or if this is something the Foundation helps with), but that would be a question for the organizers there.
Team Barcelona – 20,000 Euros for t-shirts?! Perhaps you could outsource that to Hungary if you get the event and shave an order of magnitude off the cost.
Costs
Team Budapest definitely emphasizes the desire to keep costs low as a priority, though both conferences come in close in projected costs. Another cool thing about the Budapest proposal is they would actually be offering scholarships to attendees, especially from E. Europe area. One distinction, Barcelona proposes to have speakers be free, whereas in Budapest they would pay half the registration cost. Most of the costs will be outside registration anyway, so here are some notes on other items:
- Airfare: Cheapest airfare today for both events from Atlanta, GA USA: Budapest US$725 (15 hrs, 1 stop) or Barcelona US$905 (25 hrs and 2 stops…yuk!) or US$1098 (12 hrs, 1 stop) or $1126 (direct, 10 hrs)
- Hotel: From what I could tell, this is cheaper in Budapest (hope you get a nice hostel for 40 Euros per night in Barcelona!).
- Taxi to airport: cost is equal for both places (note: one says “to” airport and the other “from”, which general are different prices…).
- Burgernomics: The Big Mac Index suggests Hungary would be a cheaper place to eat rainforest-clearing-hormone-laden burgers, if you were so inclined.
Plone Community
Barcelona and the host university have a clear presence in the proposal – the university itself has over 100 Plone sites and 5 years of history in Plone! On the other hand, Budapest/E. Europe have the most to gain in terms of fueling the Plone community there. Tough call here…
Language and other travel issues
I can’t make heads or tails of magyar, but can only muddle through catalan (even though I speak castellano). The Barcelona proposal doesn’t really mention the issue of language for foreign travelers. Doesn’t seem I need a visa to visit either country, which is nice.
Location and Venue
I don’t know either of these places, and I think both would offer great experience, exploration, and sights. I get the impression that Barcelona is more in the middle of things, though I really can’t say because I don’t know either of the places.
The Barcelona proposal has better pictures of the venue, which make it seem like a very professional facility. I worry about acoustics in the big hall, and the picture from the Budapest conference makes it look like just has chairs set out in an enormous hall (sounds quality with 400 yacking plonistas??), though perhaps these pictures are from there too, which suggests a nicer facility.
I was surprised that both proposals referenced the time it would take to get from conference location to city centers (and other points), neither of them clarified by what means of transportation they assumed!
Muscle
Lots of heavy lifting involved in conference organizing! Barcelona has more people and potential support groups mentioned. Budapest has some seriously committed people (including OSI, which is ready to put cash on the table for scholarships), which is positive, but numbers are important.
Legacy
What will the impact be of holding our annual event in one of these 2 places? This is what I call the “legacy” of the conferece. In this area, I think our legacy would be much more interesting in Budapest, because (a) we fuel an emerging community, (b) the OSI’s funding of participants from the region is a great stimulus and (c) our economic impact is probably more notable in Eastern Europe.
Weather
Though not my highest priority, I do enjoy being outside, and hopefully the conference organizers will remember that to incorporate life outside the box into the conference 
. In this regard, I have a feeling Barcelona, right on the Mediterranean, will be hard to beat. Sounds like Hungary is getting cool and gray this time of year.
Well, I don’t think I have settled anything for myself here…but getting closer. If this generates any response, hopefully I can wrap up a decision before the deadline 
.
Foundation members: please remember to vote!
i’m not fundation member but i’m planning to go to my first plone conf, but i read the applications, to see what can i expect.
been in both cities in last year and a half. (barcelona this summer, budapest last year). dont expect much english in both cities. perpare your hands to talk. i’m talking about general image there i susspect organizers are speaking english.
if you mentioned the weather you should also mentioned food and drinks. here are my impressions…
Local Food & Drinks
when talking about drinks i think budapest wins. hungary has very good wines. dont expect any local beers to be good in both cities, if you find it you’re a lucky bastard. but austria and germany is close so no panic.
, but i drink rum in spain so “who is wine?”.
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budapest: since we are in the same area i dont found food that much different then ours. (i’m from slovenia) the only thing i found weird is that they have sweet pickles (that little green things). imagine you come to restorant youi expect to be sour but its sweet.
barcelona: food in barcelona is much much much better then in budapest at least i found it that way. good spanish wine is expensive so mostly you get cheap wine which is horrible. thats why they inveted sangria i guess
but on the end i dont worry about where plone conference will be. both offers are great so it will be another great plone conf. i perfer barcelona a little bit since i found the city more interesting in many ways, but this is a selfish choice, since budapest does not miss anything important for conference.
One thing that is important to me, is that only one of them mentioned the environment.
Hi guys,
First thanks for your post! Its important to discuss about the propols in order to clarify the information. In our case we are really used to organize cientific conferences similar to plone conference. We wrote on the proposal more floss/important ones.
In your budget questions: there is no problem if we don’t get enought funds. Is a risk that we assume. The 20000€ per person kncludes the tshirt, a nice bag with plone logo and the price of the external professional company that take care about registration, taxes, invoices. We use them on all the international congress.
As we wrote on the proposal we have the plan to give grants to internatiomal studients in order to get a free entrance. Also local students will have academic credits.
The sound on auditori room is good as is designed as an Auditorium.
Sorry to be short on my answer but i’m out office and iphone is so slow!
I hope i clarified your questions!
Ramon Navarro
@garbas – great! thanks for mentioning food and drink. I am a fan of both
. Besides the pickles, what is typical for Hungary? How do non-meat eaters do there? I imagine Barcelona has lots of local seafood options, no?
Bummer about the local beers…maybe the organizers can scout out some quality local breweries and add some kegs to the conference budget!
@andy mckay – great point! I had planned to mention that, but I think the wine got the best of me before I remembered. The Budapest proposal mentioned working on minimizing the impact on the environment, and that was good. Barcelona didn’t mention this. There are a lot of things to think about in that regard, so hopefully whoever organizes can get assistance on that.
I don’t have too good pictures from the venue on ELTE in Budapest. Their website is down currently (maybe they should convert to Plone?
I uploaded a few random snapshots that I took, as well as some printed material about the location.
http://greenfinity.hu/conference-venue-pics
(On one picture you see Maurizio Delmonte from the back, he visited Budapest in the summer and I showed him around a bit.)
About the food. Hungarian cuisine has some characteristics. First of all, meat is inevitable. Traditional eating habits are unhealthy, although this is changing somewhat. Lot of spices are used. One of the mostly used spice is “paprika” which is powdered red pepper and it comes in hot and delicate (sweet) variants.
Seafish is not traditional since Hungary has no sea. There is a selection of river and lake fishes, in fact the very hot “fisherman’s soup” (halászlé) is one of the most known traditional meals. Another widely known meal is “gulyás” which actually is also a rich soup when served in Hungary.
I suggest to check out this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuisine_of_Hungary , don’t miss to check out the cabbage meals, pancakes, and sweets.
Altogether, Hungary is not a vegetarian paradise, but more and more restaurants provide a vegetarian or vegan selection. And, needless to say, that there will be a vegetarian option during the conference.
Bese wishes,
I don’t have too good pictures about the Budapest location. At the moment the venue’s website is down, we told them but they have not fixed it yet. (Maybe they should convert to Plone?) So, I post a few random pictures I took on location, as well as the scan of the information leaflet about the center.
http://greenfinity.hu/conference-venue-pics
Btw, on the last picture you see Mairizio Delmonte from the back, taken in the summer when I showed him around the place.
About food. Hungary has a characteristic cuisine, it’s very meat based and spiced, altogether traditional food is not very healthy. The trend is changing though. Amongst the typical spices we have powdered red pepper (”paprika”), that comes in both hot and sweet (delicate) version. Seafood is available but not traditional, since Hungary has no sea. There are traditional meals with river and lake fishes. one of the most known one is the “halászlé” (fisherman’s soup). Another known meal is “gulyás” which is (if served in Hungary) actually a rich soup as well (cow-boy’s soup).
You will find the description of some interesting traditional meals, pancakes, and a wide selection of sweets, on the following page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_cuisine
As a vegetarian I must admit Hungary is not a vegetarian paradise. However more and more restaurants offer a vegetarian and vegan selection. Needless to say, that vegan food will be available as a choice during the conference.
Best wishes,